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When I first adopted Dexter, during Labor Day weekend of 2003, he was so full of anxiety that for a full month, he would chew the tip of his tail bloody, beginning the moment he heard my car pulling into the driveway. Clearly, he thought I was going to walk through that door and start yelling at him or beating on him or doing whatever unspeakable thing his previous owner had done to him. Once during that first month, he accidentally knocked over an end table―this caused him to panic and run out the doggie door and under the picnic table, where he crouched, shivering, for about an hour. No amount of coaxing by me or his friend Sunny could persuade him that it was safe to come out. It was heartbreaking how much psychological damage had already been inflicted on him by the tender age of 1 year.
Dexter's phobias extended to both children and men. I started filling the hands of children we met on the street with treats for Dexter, and his opinion of the little people soon began to change. With men, however, it was a little tougher. The treat trick only went so far.
So it shouldn't have come as a surprise to me when, on his third trip to our veterinary chiropractor, Dr. Paul Rowan (this time without his pillar of strength, Sunny), he had a full-blown panic attack. Dexter has never liked having things done to him, so a spinal manipulation by a tall man really put him over the edge. It was horrible! He was in an altered state of mind―so terrified that he looked like a completely different dog.
For three years, I never took him back, even though, God knows, he needed to be adjusted. Dexter is the kind of dog who leaps before he looks. His usual modus operandi is to get from point A to point B as quickly as possible, whether by dashing, leaping, lurching, or lunging. I did manage to desensitize him enough to take him to a female conventional veterinarian for his annual heartworm blood tests and later to a female veterinary acupuncturist, who, over the course of three appointments, got him to relax and be comfortable. But the thought of going back to Dr. Rowan again was truly daunting.
However, recently Dexter started to get a chronic limp in one of his front legs that seemed to be coming from his shoulder, and I knew that Dr. Rowan was the best person to take him to, so I bit the bullet and made the appointment. Luckily, Dr. Rowan is now working out of his own home, so the atmosphere there is homey, like a living room. I also slipped Dexter an herbal calming agent to take the edge off. And I brought Rowdy along for moral support―as well as a bunch of tasty treats. And then there was the gerbil. Dr. Rowan had gotten his kids a gerbil, whose unfortunate fate it was to be in a cage on the floor in that same room. That unexpected distraction turned out well for Dexter if not for the gerbil. In any case, it all went very smoothly! Dexter got adjusted, and there was nothing wrong with his shoulder―his neck was just out of whack. Hallelujah! That's progress.
Additional progress could be seen this morning, when Dexter raced through the house and knocked over a metallic trash can with a loud clanging sound. Instead of hiding and cringing in fear, as he would have three years ago, he just sat there wagging his tail while I righted the trashcan and told him how silly he was.
Dexter does seem to benefit from incremental, slow desensitization to help him work through his fears. But there is another method, called "flooding," that has become extra controversial since the sometimes beloved and sometimes despised Cesar Millan began showcasing it in his Dog Whisperer TV show. In one very memorable episode in the first season, he helped a Great Dane overcome his fear through the use of flooding. The dog had been a school mascot, attending along with his guardian, who was a teacher there. Then one day, the dog ran smack into a glass wall, and his guardian made such a fuss over the incident that the dog developed a phobia and refused to set foot back inside the school.
Cesar's approach was to tire the dog out by running him around the block numerous times and then running him straight through the front doors of the school. Of course, they only got a few feet inside before the dog put on the brakes. At that point, he became petrified. But Cesar walked a few feet ahead of him and stood quietly and waited for the dog to follow, and eventually he did! They continued, step by step, until it got easier and easier, and within a half-hour, that dog was back to normal, walking calmly down the halls of the school! It was actually quite moving. Cesar said, "This is the hardest day of this dog's life," and he really seemed to appreciate and understand what the dog was going through.
Many people take issue with flooding, saying that it's mean and disrespectful and can backfire, causing a dog to become even more sensitive. I don't know about the backfiring, but I have to say that I don't think it's so terrible under the right circumstances. In fact, I've used it myself. I have fostered five Chihuahua mixes from the same hideous puppy mill, and each of them came to me scared to death. With the first two, Joey and Chandler, whom I fostered sequentially, I basically forced myself on them, holding them on my lap for the duration of a movie or two, and after that, we were best buds! They both became completely normal within a few months and now live in a wonderful home together. Every time I see them, they go wild, climbing all over me.
Now, in contrast, with the three Chihuahua mix girls from the puppy mill, I decided to try the slow, sensitive, respectful approach, without forcing myself on them, and guess what? After 16, 12, and 10 months, respectively, they're still not normal or completely trusting of me. In fact, Sarah only recently stopped looking at me as if I were an ax murderer, Theresa still won't let me put a harness on her without first herding her onto the front porch, and Sophia still cringes sometimes when I look at her. I have to wonder if it isn't better to just get it over with and make them face their fears, instead of letting this fearfulness go on and on and on. After all, it's no fun being scared! In fairness, I have to say that the girls have come a long way: Two of them sleep with me and let me pet them most of the time, but there's still a long way to go before they can be called "normal" in the sense that Joey and Chandler are now normal. This is just my opinion (and feel free to try to get me to change it), but I think flooding can be done in a respectful and sensitive manner, depending on the particular dog and the particular fear.
In a way, I feel like I experienced flooding myself in 1993 when I had to face my driving phobia. It may seem like I had a choice in the matter, but I really didn't―not in the real world. If I hadn't confronted my phobia, I would have had to quit my job, and my whole life would have fallen apart. So I just did it. I got behind the wheel. I had to write out directions on index cards, and I could only drive to one destination and then back home again at first. I hadn't driven in probably a decade, and I was really scared. But now I enjoy driving (as long as I have a functioning radio in the car!), and I'm really glad I was forced to overcome that psychological hurdle.
Comments ( 12 )
When a human being has a phobia, what do they do? They go to a therapist, reassure themselves, or might even bite the bullet and face their fear. Dogs are not like that. If they're scared of something, why shouldn't they ignore it? Flooding has a 50% chance of working and a 50% of a dog failing. Good for the dog, Millan succeeded. On the National Geographic channel 'Don't try this at home' can flash on the screen as much as it wants, not everyone will listen. Soon, you have people trying this technique which worked so well for this guy on TV. And if they fail...Fido just got ten times worse. And who wants to take that chance? I certainly wouldn't. So even if you were a professional dog trainer, why would you use this technique when there's even the slightest chance of the dog coming out worse in the end? And why would you show millions of viewers and not expect a few of them to try? The more gentle and positive approach will be long. But on the bright side, no matter how long it might take you, your dog is slowly getting better. Under the perfect circumstances, yes, maybe flooding could help. But why risk it? Why advocate it when many people sitting on their couches at home suddenly think this is a perfect way to help Fido get over his fear of cars? I see flooding as a very dangerous training method that can backfire and only make situations worse. That Millan is publicly advertising it on TV makes it all the more dangerous.
Posted by Marie | March 19, 2008 8:14 PM
Posted on March 19, 2008 20:14
Hey KP,
If you watch carefully, you'll see that the Dane has a slip/choke collar on, and pressure is being applied every time that he stops (aka he is being choked.) The pain stops when he walks forward. He can not make the choice to back up, he can not make any "choice" but go forward. This smacks of slavery, of DO IT BECAUSE I'M YOUR MASTER AND I SAY SO. Also, I'd like to see a 6 month follow up on the dog, to see if any other behaviors have developed. Also, though the dog is "happily" bowling through the door at the end of the show, a careful viewing reveals the dog showing stress behaviors (panting, hugging the wall, lip licking.)
MOST IMPORTANTLY:
There were other, more humane ways that this dog could have been taught to walk through those doors. Until those other methods are EXHAUSTED, pain is never warrented, and neither is causing the animal extreme fear.
There are many things you can do to foster a good relationship with your foster chi's. Some things I would try before going to flooding include:
-Teaching eye contact and how to maintain it...this would be especially helpful for Sophia.
-Playing the name game (this means, teaching the dog their name means wonderful things ALWAYS)
-Implimenting a Nothing in Life is Free program. This means, good behavior facilitates the pleasures in life. For example, my dog sits to have his collar put on until released, sits before doors until released, sits until after released for toys and food too..
- Doings body handling set-ups. I like to teach a down stay before I do this. Then, when the dog is in a down stay, I reach for the paw and click and treat before the dog gets anxious. I do this over and over again for different body parts all the time.
-I would teach a Sit/Maintain to your dog who is fearful of the harness, and then use the harness to prove the maintain/stay. (Will you sit if I take this harness out? click/treat Will you sit if its close to your face? Click/treat)
Sure, this takes more effort then simply forcing an animal to comply. But they result in a happy, calm, trusting dog.
Everything Ceasar does is based on force and punishment. The tssst sound is at first paired with collar pops, looming, and pinches to the neck. These cause pain and fear, so eventually a dog freezes/stops when they hear the noise. This is known as learned helplessneess or "shutdown" in the training world.
Instead of using the tssst, which is a startle followed by looming (scary) body language (and it sounds like your dogs are very fearful) you could teach a stop cue. The dog would be calm, turned to you for further instruction, and not feel as if they are doing something "bad."
Anyway, I'f you'd like details on the various games and techniques I use, I could make you a vid of me doing then with my dog or write out the recipe for each one I teach. You could start with our first game (the name game) and see how you like it.
>>>KP's Reponse:
Hi Gia,
Please explain how you would have handled the Great Dane's phobia. In a severe case like that, treats are not going to do it, because dogs don't eat when they're scared.
With regard to my fosters, I'm already doing most of the things that you suggested (except the "body-handling set-ups." Sophia does maintain eye contact most of the time--it's just occasionally that she'll cringe when I look at her, probably because she's taken off-guard, such as if I walk into a room unexpectedly.
I never use their names for anything negative--just to get their attention, usually to give them an empty toilet paper roll to play with or to call their attention to something else fun.
I use the "No Free Lunch" program most of the time but not with petting since they need to be petted and that would restrict it too much. I can't exactly tell them to sit if they're already snuggled up beside me in bed.
Also, since these dogs are so small, they can only have so many treats. One of them is already struggling with her weight (or, rather, I'm struggling to take weight off her).
One factor that I have going against me is that these puppy mill dogs tend to feed off each other's fear. They do seem to recover more quickly when they're separated out from the fearful pack for a while, but I can't do that with these girls because they're "joined at the hip."
The only things that I really have to correct with the little girls are that Theresa tends to try to lick Rowdy's face too much (he hates that) and that she also likes to dig on the rugs. In both instances, I say, "Ooops!" and then call her over to me to get petted. Any suggestions on how to move this along?
I do think that you're exaggerating Cesar Millan's negativity. I've used the "chhhht" sound on my big dogs, and it does stop them in their tracks, but it certainly doesn't seem to have any harmful side effects. And the whole looming thing is greatly exaggerated. That's just what dogs do to each other when they are trying to dominate, but it certainly doesn't terrorize them. I see 7-pound Sophia doing it to 10-pound Sarah when she wants Sarah's chew toy, and Sarah gives it up and then goes back to happily playing. It's just not a big deal to dogs. It's a big deal to humans. If a human loomed over me, I would expect them to beat me up, but dogs have more restraint and subtlety about stuff like that.
KP
Posted by Gia | March 20, 2008 5:33 PM
Posted on March 20, 2008 17:33
KP:
For the great dane I first would have taught him some basic obedience. I would have taught him to give me eye contact and his focused attention on cue. I would have taught him how to sit and stay, and most importantly I would have taught him how to target, or bump and follow my hand with his nose. I wouldn't have pushed him to an extent that he would be fearful, and not take treats or reinforcement. We would first practice targeting outside the school, after sufficient exercise. Then, we would have practiced targeting on the steps. Gradually, after a few days I'm sure the dog would be willingly targeting my hand into and across the floors. I would also have possibly but some non-skid dog boots on the dog to prevent another bad experience.
By eyecontact/maintain I mean, have you taught the dogs a cue that means "give me your undivided attention, stare into my eyes, until i release you?" This is the first thing I teach people, aside from the dogs' name. I think its the first step in building a relationship with ones dog, because it teaches them how to relinquish distractions, the environment, anything, in favor of interacting with you. If you taught this cue/skill to your dogs, you'd have increased attentiveness, and staring would become a very positive experience to them (hopefully).
If Theresa is licking Rowdy's face too much (and I'm not there to see it) I usually just let the dog who is being licked deal with this problem. Here, I've noticed that the puppies under 1.5-2 looooove to lick and lick the older dogs faces. Its a submissive or play soliciting behavior. The older dogs tell them to back off, and generally they do. I haven't seen this behavior in dogs over 2, so I think its there way of learning how to properly socialize.
If you are using OOOPS as a way to just get her attention, and then redirecting her to something else, I don't see a problem there, if its working for you. I teach my dogs "leave it" in a pretty novel way. You could use this in the rug situation. The jist of the training is, I have the dog on a leash inside at first on their flat collar. I put a distraction on the floor, like some really yummy fresh food. I walk the dog up to the food, and without letting them eat the food at first, let them go for it and hit the end of the leash. I stand as still as a post. I say nothing. When the dog turns away from the distraction, I click and treat, and click and treat, all while moving rapidly back from the distraction. Gradually, after a week of practicing that for 5 minutes or so every day, I would introduce my verbal cue. "Leave it" (or yuccky or whatever) right before they feel stopped. So its verbal cue followed by old cue, which was a taught leash. Soon, they will leave it on cue. To teach them to leave it permanently, I make sure to release the dog after each setup (free! is my word) and then we do it again.
Also, if the dog likes to dig so much, you could get a child's sand box, fill it with unbleached sand, and hide a couple chew treats in the sand. Then, they have an appropriate outlet for the digging behavior.
As far as looming goes: Dogs that have been well socialized with other dogs read each others language very well. In my experience, people, including ceasar, do not. Ceasar often looms above dogs long after they begin showing signs of fear (calming signals) for example. He labels everything as dominance (I like to say a dog is high drive, or highly motivated). In the dog world, a dog would have stopped looming long before most people do. Really, when there are so many other tools to build a relationship looming isn't necessary. In other words, your dogs can read each other very well, far better than any human can. I remember in one situation, ceasar was "rehabbing" a white fluffy spitz type dog, who was "aggressive". Ceasar loomed over the dogs cage, practically laying on it, as the dog had a full blown "rage" inside. A careful viewing though, shows how intensely fearful this poor dog was. He was panting, eyes wide, lip licking.
Dogs are facilitative learners when it comes to other dogs, so they will for sure feed off each others fears, or feed of confidence. I wouldn't seperate dogs based on this, unless it was seriously affecting their quality of life.
I just don't see how there is a place for a trainer like Ceasar Milan, when there are other more positive ways to build a relationship with a dog based on friendship and trust, not one based on dominance and pain.
Posted by Anonymous | March 21, 2008 5:04 PM
Posted on March 21, 2008 17:04
Hey KP,
I was doing some thinking and I'd like to add this: If Ceasar was truly the "leader" of these dogs, why then was Kane on leash?
If he was truly leading these dogs, if they trusted him, the leash would not be necessary. Leadership I think is different than domination, which Ceasar does by forcing the dog to stay in close range of him. If given the choice, I think Kane would have RUN home.
Hi Gia,
I think you're misunderstanding him. He's trying to become the pack leader, but he's dealing with a very screwed-up dog, not a normal dog. So it's a work in progress. He, in fact, says in his book that you have to show yourself to be the pack leader every day. So it's not like pushing a button--it's an ongoing effort. A dog who is experiencing a panic attack isn't going to be interpreting anything correctly, but Cesar was trying to lead the Great Dane out of his terror, and he succeeded. Very quickly, too, I might add.
KP
Posted by Gia | March 25, 2008 5:28 PM
Posted on March 25, 2008 17:28
A dog experiencing a panic attack won't interpret anything correctly. Which is exactly why flooding is dangerous. Both for a dog and the human. If I knew one of my dogs was having a panic attack I would quickly step back and let the poor dog calm down.
Show yourself to be a pack leader every day? Dogs are more controlling then I thought. When I wake up in the morning the first thing I do is greet my dogs and play with them a little before taking them for a walk. But Millan says to put affection last. I guess a better question would be, what's a dog trying to gain by being a 'pack leader'? I let my dogs do everything Millan claims is a sign of dominance, but my dogs still show no signs of dominance.
Millan led the dog into and out of his terror. Now the next time that Great Dane goes to cross that floor, he'll be looking around for his 'leader' to bring him through his terror again.
Posted by Marie | March 26, 2008 7:25 PM
Posted on March 26, 2008 19:25
Hey KP,
I was just wondering if my other comment, with the link of the episode involving Kane, went through to you.
I was thinking more about it after viewing the clip... you had said
"but Cesar was trying to lead the Great Dane out of his terror, and he succeeded. Very quickly, too, I might add."
Kane was not lead out of his terror. His tucked tail, avoidance behaviors, and nervous panting show that this dog is still very much terrified. I am certain he is experiencing "learned helplessness." I know from his body language he is still terrifed, if not more so. He however has learned that he better do what his owner says, or else he'll be having his airflow restricted.
Did you review the video? What are your thoughts?
>>>KP's Response:
Hi Gia,
Yes, I finally got a chance to review it just now. My feeling is that you're really exaggerating. Most of the time, Cesar had a slack leash on Kane. And the nervous panting at the end could easily have been from being surrounded by about 30 screaming kids and a guy playing the guitar. That's enough to make any dog nervous. Plus, that was only a few days later. I think you're nitpicking and Kane is much happier now that he's rid himself of that phobia.
KP
Posted by Gia | March 28, 2008 4:59 PM
Posted on March 28, 2008 16:59
Hey KP,
Sure, most of the time he had a slack leash on Kane. But, at multiple points in the "training" he was leash popping him and cutting off his air supply. Dogs are fast learners, and if you cut off their air they are going to learn they had better follow you.
If Kane was much happier, wouldn't he then be at least showing some signs of happiness while in the school and walking through the hall? Yes, it was only a few days later. One trend with Ceasar's show and book is that concrete follow ups are never done. Real follow ups occur after several weeks or even months.
Also, if the choke collar wasn't a motivator for him to do the task, WHY is it still on him even after he has been "rehabilitated?" If he was following his leader in reality, he wouldn't need a collar that hurts him and cuts off his air supply.
It wasn't just that he was panting at the end "followup." His tail was tightly tucked between his legs too, the whole time, even before he entered the room with all the children. We know he enjoyed visiting the school and the children prior to slipping and hitting the door, so the children probably weren't the reason why he was panicking.
Part of respecting animals is also respecting their limitations. There was no real reason why this dog should be forced to go into this building. It wouldn't have hindered his life in any way had he not gone in. Therefore, the owners could have humanely trained this dog, though it might have taken a week of short sessions and not a few hours.
If you could find one I'd love to see a video of Ceasar respecting a dogs' body language, while training without using fear or choke collars. I've seen plenty of his episodes but have yet to see any respectful training yet.
Hi Gia,
See, you really exaggerate, Gia. He wasn't "cutting off [Kane's] air supply." That's just a total exaggeration.
Also, that's completely untrue that Cesar never follows up. In fact, he often follows up. I even saw one episode in which he followed up on a dog who had been euthanized because the guardian simply wouldn't follow through on his advice. Are you really watching his show? How many episodes have you seen?
And the fact that the choke collar, which I don't approve of, was still on Kane in the elementary school when the kids were there was because he wasn't with Cesar, he was with his guardian, who was still learning too. It's often a work in progress--not because of Cesar, but becasue of the guardians themselves who are slow on the uptake.
We didn't see any video of Kane with the children prior to the accident, so it's certainly also possible that he was uncomfortable with them even before the accident and the guardian just didn't recognize behavioral signs of discomfort.
However, I totally agree with you that there was no reason to force Kane to overcome his fear of entering the school. But I think he was scared of all shiny flooring, so they were hoping that it would extrapolate to other places with linoleum flooring as well.
I actually think that Cesar always respects dogs' body language--that's one of the best things about him. He gets dogs, and he communicates with them in their own language, and to me, that is highly respectful.
KP
Posted by Gia | March 31, 2008 11:55 AM
Posted on March 31, 2008 11:55
Millan reads dog's body language, then ignores it. That could get pretty confusing for the dog.
I have read one of his books and have watched several of his episodes. But I don't think it matters how many episodes Gia watches. She's seen enough to know she just doesn't agree with the methods he has. I do agree with some of the things he does, but I've watched and disagreed with enough of his episodes to know I don't agree with him. Now, there's a chance all the episodes I've watched of him have not been good ones, but that's a pretty big bet. However, I don't think Gia is exaggerating at all. That dog did not want to move forward, he was making that dog face its fear, even if it meant cutting off the air supply.
And as you said, Kane's owners were slow on the uptake. They're just not professional dog trainers. Although I don't think flooding should be practiced by any trainer, least of all by dog owners who know little of training. And so even after going through that shock with Millan, he has to do it all over again. And again and again because who knows if his owners are doing the flooding technique right or not?
Posted by Marie | April 1, 2008 2:20 PM
Posted on April 1, 2008 14:20
KP:
What do you think happens when the leash was taut (which ceasar did sevaral times when Kane balked) and the collar tightens around his neck? Put one on yourself and make the line taut, it cuts of the air supply, and hurts the dog. This is why Kane is moving forward. If Ceasar wasn't using negative reinforcement in this case, he would have used Kane's regular flat collar. If Ceasar is such a dog, why does he need a leash, and a choke collar to FORCE this dog to do what he wants?
Ceasar should do followup's that show a happy, confident dog several months, not weeks later. I've seen at least 10 episodes of the show, and haven't once seen an episode where the goal is achieved humanely (i.e without force) and the result is a happy confident dog.
I do not feel that Ceasar communicates with dogs in their own language. First off, he uses leashes, and leashes with choke collars. Leashes impede a dogs ability to communicate, and so many modern trainers do off lead training now (when possible). He also continues to make dogs uncomfortable even after they are throwing out calming signals and fear signals like crazy. Another dog wouldn't have forced Kane to walk through that hall. Respecting a dog to me, means listening to them when they speak. If they say they are scared, I stop whatever I'm doing thats making them feel that way.
If you could pick out another episode that you feel shows Ceasar's success, I'd like to critique it, and his dog communication skills. If its one I could stream live that would be perfect.
Because Kane was fearful, and because Ceasar ignored this fear and used a choke collar, I do not feel this episode is moving, or depicting a good human/dog relationship or success story.
>>>KP's Response:
Hi Gia,
I'm sorry, but I've watched the episode, and again, you're exaggerating. Kane did indeed move of his own accord with the leash slack. I saw it, so don't keep saying that Cesar was pulling him constantly along and cutting off his air supply. That's really not a fair description of the episode.
Cesar certainly did not ignore Kane's fear or body language. You seem to have missed the whole point of the episode. Kane's fear was debilitating him. It wasn't just the floor of the school--he couldn't walk on ANY shiny surfaces, including wet roads. (If it had just been the floor of the school, I would have said to let Kane stay home--he doesn't have to go to the school.) You sound like you wanted Cesar to enable Kane and buy into his fear, but that would not have done him any favors. Instead, Cesar helped Kane overcome the fear, which is a very kind thing to do.
Also, if I recall correctly, Cesar started doing his follow-ups in the second season, and he did a lot of them and did show happy dogs months later. So take a look at season two.
KP
Posted by Gia | April 10, 2008 4:53 PM
Posted on April 10, 2008 16:53
When Kane and Ceasar walk into the building, the second he balks Ceasar puts pressure on the leash. He does this several times in the beginning. It only takes 1-2 times for a dog to learn it better follow the leash-holder, because it is avoiding the chocking sensation caused by balking.
Yes, Kane walked along without being "corrected" but only after he was corrected several times. If Ceasar was really leading and not forcing this dog, he woudln't have had to have a leash on. In the "followup" Kane still has the choke collar on. This is because, since negative reinforcement has been used, the tool needs to remain on the dog for the response to continuing. Remove the tool used to inflict pain (even once or twice) and you don't have that moving forward response.
Do you really believe that Kane overcame his fear? What I see is an extremely frightened dog going into a situation he finds terrifying because of learned helplessness. He has learned he better walk through or else. Ceasar does several quick corrections on this dog, and thats enough to quickly teach them what to do.
I have seen some of Ceasar's follow ups, and I see dogs following their owners rules due to coercion. I want to see happy, non-stressed dogs. Dogs that comply but with extreme nervous behavior tells me the dog is being forced to go against its nature, not choosing to.
If you can find me a clip of a dog thats been through the training doing what it previously wouldn't do before with glee, confidently, and happily, I'd like to see it.
>>>KP's Response:
Gia,
Guess we'll just have to agree to disagree on this.
KP
Posted by Gia | April 18, 2008 12:00 AM
Posted on April 18, 2008 00:00
What exactly don't you agree on?
I'm just shocked that an animal rights site would advocate a man who chokes and hits dogs as a way to "rehabilitate" them, and has dogs trained through supression and learned helplessness. If you could find me a case where he doesn't use fear/pain tactics on a dog, I'd like to see that.
The fact that Kane has a choke collar on is very telling.
>>>KP's Response:
Gia,
I've said repeatedly that I don't approve of choke collars and that I don't agree with everything that Cesar Millan does. I don't "advocate" him. I've simply stated very clearly what I do like about him. Not everything is cut and dried or black and white.
KP
Posted by Gia | April 19, 2008 2:08 AM
Posted on April 19, 2008 02:08
I'm wondering why you haven't produced for me a video clip, showing Cesar training a dog, without a choke collar or pinching, and the dog performing with happiness and joy. I'd like to see some of his purported magic in action.
I've watched many episodes, and haven't seen one yet that shows this.
>>>KP's Response:
Gia,
Almost every time you comment, you ask or demand that I provide you with some written or videotaped evidence to back up my opinions. Perhaps you think that this blog is all I do all day long? Unfortunately, just about every single minute of each of my days is booked with work- or dog-related activities, and it's all I can do to keep up with just reading these comments. I simply don't have time to respond to your many "homework assignments," and the fact that I have up to now ignored each and every one of them should be a not-too-subtle message to you that I don't appreciate them and have no intention of spending my time on them. Furthermore, if you have been watching the Dog Whisperer show and have not yet seen anything positive, then you probably never will because you've already made up your mind about Cesar and are unwilling to see anything that contradicts that view, so it would be futile for me to spend time on your "homework assignments" anyway.
KP
Posted by Gia | April 22, 2008 1:05 AM
Posted on April 22, 2008 01:05